Watch, Wait, And Be Ready In the Wilderness
A discussion of Ignatian spirituality featuring musician Danielle Savard and her new song "The Wilderness"
Happy Tuesday!
This week I am excited to share a conversation with inspirational musician Danielle Savard, as we dive deep into the meaning behind her song “The Wilderness” which came out last week. I was intrigued to explore some of the connections between the song and Ignatian spirituality, discernment, and even some C.S. Lewis.
I first met Danielle Savard in 2023 and was instantly drawn to her deep sense of spirituality and inner joy.
We have many shared interests and experiences, including our alma mater (shout out to Canadian Mennonite University), and both of us have dipped our toes into the world of counseling. But perhaps most strikingly, both of us have gone through the Ignatian Spiritual Exercises, an intensive program that amongst many things, invites you to learn to discern God’s voice as you grow in self-awareness. That is the angle at which we approached our conversation about “The Wilderness.”
I invite you to listen to the song and then enjoy our discussion.
For the sake of clarity, Danielle’s words are italicized while mine are bold and the conversation has been edited.
As we begin, can we talk about what the wilderness means for you?
“A lot of my songwriting and a lot of my… prayer life, I mean, it comes from just that solitude with Christ. And so when I think of the wilderness, I think of the physical woods that I often walk through when I want to connect with Him or think about new songs to write.
So I think of it physically, but then I also think of it interiorly. I think of the inner landscape of what I'm going through and what I'm struggling with. And that often has been a terrain of trust.
It's a challenge to trust more. So I think of the wilderness as an interior terrain of, “OK, I'm going through incredible uncertainty right now and I'm struggling to trust God with these things. And I don't know how this is going to turn out.”
When you are speaking of being in the forest, there's for you a sense that the wilderness has sort of a familiarity to it. But then as you were talking about the internal wilderness, you were saying words like uncertainty and speaking of not knowing where you are going. It is interesting how the wilderness can be a sort of comforting place, but also something that pushes you beyond your comfort zone.
It is scary because you can get lost in the woods. You can get lost in all the possibilities of how a situation can go, or if something you are praying for is going to come now or if it is going to come later. All the questions of what the future is going to look like.
And the song ends very unconventionally, “lead the way, lead the way, lead the way.” We don't know the way out of the woods, but He does. And it comes down to holding his hand.
Assiniboine Forest, behind Canadian Mennonite University in Winnipeg, Manitoba.
You've mentioned a few times that you went through the Ignatian Spiritual Exercises during the pandemic. A big part of this is learning to hear what is God's voice and what is not God's voice. In the song, you are speaking and listening to God and being sensitive to where He is calling you. How did the opportunity of going through the Exercises help you learn how to discern God's voice when you are in that place of wilderness and uncertainty?
The spiritual exercises of St. Ignatius changed my life. They are called exercises for a reason! And I tell people it is like a spiritual workout and you work out every day. The program was eight months of an hour of prayer a day.
You are going through scripture, you are meditating on it, you are journaling, and then you are speaking with a spiritual director once a week and reporting the things that happened in prayer. “These are the obstacles that are coming up for me, this is what's touched me and resonated with me.” When you just dive in and get your feet wet in that content, you realize, “okay, I can kind of get in touch with the undercurrents that are happening inside of me.”
“Why am I feeling anxious about this? Or why am I so distracted by this?” And “oh, I'm finding peace with this potential decision, and I didn't expect that.” I think of it very much as getting in touch with our internal compass and sacred space of direction with God.
He speaks to us in so many different ways. Some people get a deep knowing, where they just know something brings them peace. And for other people, it's through journaling or external confirmations. But I think of it as getting to know the lay of the interior land.
It's a training ground. In the Ignatian exercises, we are given rules of discernment. I think of it as the art of war.
These are the attacks you might experience when your soul is in a desolate state or this is how the enemy might try to trip you up. There's a bit of a rule book of basic guidelines that I have personally experienced. Now I know some of the strategies of the enemy.
So then I'm going to strengthen those parts of me that are weaker because, as St. Ignatius says, our heart is like a fortress and our enemy is out not just to harm, but to kill and destroy. And he's going to try and find out those weaker parts of your fortress and just hammer hard, trying to get access to your interior and shake your peace. How do we strengthen against that? It's prayer, scripture, having a solid community, all those things.
There were a couple of things that I thought of when I was listening to your song. The first was just how striking it is that you are very clear that Jesus is with you in the wilderness. This is not you going out alone and trying to figure it out. He's there already, and even just that is comforting.
Now some of the lyrics that struck me were: hold fast, be ready, stand your ground. They are all about not rushing, not even moving unless God is telling you to. This brought to mind one of Ignatius’s rules about not making decisions or big changes when you are in a time of spiritual desolation or uncertainty. To quote:
In time of desolation, we should never make any change, but remain firm and constant in the resolution and decision which guided us the day before the desolation, or in the decision to which we adhered in the preceding consolation. For just as in consolation the good spirit guides and counsels us, so in desolation the evil spirit guides and counsels. Following his [the evil spirit’s] counsels, we can never find the way to a right decision. —Spiritual Exercises Rule I.5.
Yes, one of his hallmark rules is when you are in desolation, you don't make big life decisions, and you don't change what you knew in the light.
But the enemy wants to derail us from God's plan. God has given us everything we need to stay true to him, and to return to him.
In Narnia, there is a part where Aslan warns the two children [Eustace and Jill] that they are going to go down into a dark land, and there are going to be people that are going to try to bring you off course from the instructions I've given you. But hold onto what I've given you. Then the children go through this whole story of being tempted to go off track from the instructions because they forgot to repeat what Aslan had told them. I think that is so metaphorical, because when we are in these places, when we have these dips, these times of desolation, and that’s when we are tempted to go off course.
Art by Jef Murray.
From the Silver Chair (Aslan speaking to Jill):
But, first, remember, remember, remember the signs. Say them to yourself when you wake in the morning and when you lie down at night, and when you wake in the middle of the night. And whatever strange things may happen to you, let nothing turn your mind from following the signs. Nothing else matters.
Oh, I love that metaphor! If I remember correctly, Aslan tells Jill to remember the signs and repeat them to herself over and over again. That is similar to the Ignatian Rules in a way - the basic guidelines for spiritual warfare. If we remember them, we are less likely to get lost or confused.
When I listened to the song the first time, it struck me, with the minor chords and how it is produced, as almost a bit foreboding. It has a bit of a sound of warning. God is saying, “yes, this is the wilderness; you don't know what's around the corner. You need to stick to those instructions that I gave you to stay on course.”
You are completely right. And the intention of that was very much just to be a paradox: we are called to be at peace and not be afraid, but also be on guard. Scripture is littered with so many references to putting on armor and that God makes our hands ready for battle.
What is the battle? The battle is for our soul. I think it is in the subtlety that the enemy can work in that can derail us. And that is why we have to be on guard.
It is a mental battle a lot of the time. I feel like when people talk about the spiritual life and dealing with interior struggles and stuff, sometimes it gets a bit fluffy, but in the reality of day-to-day, it is about taking charge of those thoughts and not letting in what is not of God.
One of my favorite quotes, and I will repeat this to myself all the time, is from Searching for and Maintaining Peace by Father Jacques Philippe. And he says, “There is no good reason to lose your peace.” And whenever I start going down the trail of being anxious… I've been trying to pause and think. “Wait, there is no good reason for letting this in. It doesn't matter what it is. There is no good reason.”
And so much easier said than done.
And God gently brings us back. He says you can trust me. And we can always start over. And over time, it is like the more you work out, the stronger you get.
I can lift this right now, or I can push this right now. And I wasn't able to before.
The more time you invest in getting to know His voice, the quicker you can recognize, “okay, this is not of Him.”
I hope this conversation has been helpful for you in some way - if you are interested in learning more about Ignatian Spirituality, I would recommend Fr. Timothy Gallagher’s books on the topic. Also, here is a video that gives an overview: Fr. Gallagher on Prayer.
If you want to support Danielle, here are a few things you can do:
Pray for her! Her upcoming album, entitled “Warfare, Volume One” will be coming out during the next few months. Please pray that it will all unfold according to God’s plan!
Danielle has a local tour over the next few months. Please visit her website or follow her on social media for more details.
Consider supporting Danielle’s art financially through Patreon. You can find the link here.